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DE ARQUE Herbastus
Birth: ABT 911 Arque, Normandy
Death: 979
Notes
Herbastus de Crepon, Forester of Arques (per Stuart)
http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=jweber&id=I00381
Apparently there is no evidence of what the name was of the father of Gunnor,
Senfrie, Herfast, and Avelina. Ancestral Roots states he was a forester of Arque. He
was not of Crepon, but later genealogists mistakenly thought the family was of Crepon
because Herbastus' son, Herfast, received lands in Crepon, probably due to the
relationship of his sister with Duke Richard.
I will leave the "de Crepon" name with the family, just as I have the Plantagenet name
with that family, although the Plantagenets were not known by that name until
Richard, Duke of York in the 1400's. However I will put a "not' in front of everybody
but the son, who was "de Crepon".
-----------------------
The following is a post to SGM, 3 Dec 1996, by Todd Farmerie:
From: Todd A. Farmerie (taf2 AT po.cwru.edu)
Subject: Robert de Torigny and the family of Gunnor, Duchess of Normandy
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 1996/12/03
There have been many posts requesting information on the various Norman
relationships compiled by Robert de Torigny. This is an attempt to summarize and
harmonize several recent works on some of the lines:
Elisabeth M C van Houts. Robert of Torigni as Genealogist. in Studies in Medieval
History presented to R. Allen Brown, p.215-33.
Kathleen Thompson. The Norman Aristocracy before 1066: the Example of the
Montgomerys. in Historical Research 60:251-63.
K S B Keats-Rohan. Aspects of Torigny's Genealogy Revisited. in Nottingham
Medieval Studies 37:21-7.
Robert de Torigny, writing after the Norman Conquest, recorded the genealogical
traditions which tied many of the Norman nobility to the family of Gunnor, first mistress
of Richard I, then Duchess of Normandy. He reported the tradition that Richard had
become infatuated with the wife of one of his foresters, but being the pious wife, she
substituted her sister Gunnor, much to everyone's satisfaction. He proceded to name
the siblings of Gunnor, and also indicated the she had numerous nieces, who are left
unnamed, but whose marriages and descendants are provided.
The genealogical information contained in this account has at various times been
praised and condemned, but recent opinion seems to favor the view that, while minor
errors abound, the genealogies accurately represent a tradition of shared descent that
may account for the rapid rise of these nobles.
The parentage of Gunnor and her siblings is unknown. While some sources call her
father Herfastus, this was in fact the name of her brother. She has also been claimed
as daughter of the Danish royal family, but there is no evidence for this, and the
context of her coming to the attention of Richard I and the family's subsequent rise to
power militates against her being a royal daughter. Douglas argued (in a 1944 English
Historical Review article on the family of William Fitz Osbern), based on the donations
of brother Arfast to the monastery of St. Pere, that the root of the family was in the
Cotetin region of Normandy, but van Houts has suggested that the Cotetin land was
granted to Arfast, rather than inherited by him. Thus we are left with the more
ambiguous statements of Torigny and others that she was a member of a Norman
family of Danish origins.
The only known brother of Gunnor was Arfast/Herfast, of whom we gain what little
insight we have from a trial of heretics conducted by Robert II. Arfast testified that he
had pretended to join the sect, all the better to denounce them when the time arose.
He later donated lands to the monastery of St. Pere, to which he retired. He had at
least two sons: Osbern, who was steward to the later Dukes, and was murdered by
William de Montgomery while defending the young Duke William; and Ranulf, known
from charters. Osbern maried a niece of Richard I (the daughter of his half-brother)
and by her was the father of the Conquest baron William Fitz Osbern.
Gunnor had at least three sisters, of which the oldest appears to have been Senfria
(Seinfreda), who was wife of the (unnamed) forester from the area of St. Vaast
d'Equiqueville, and it was her charms which are said first to have attracted the
attentions Duke Richard I. She appears to have had at least one daughter, Joscelina,
wife of Hugh de Montgomery. (Torigny makes Joscelina daughter of another sister,
Wevia, but a contemporary of Torigny, in demonstrating the genealogical impediment
to a marriage of a bastard of Henry I to a Montgomery descendant specifically calls
Joscelina's mother Senfria, and the inheritance by the Montgomerys of large holdings
suggests that Joscelina was a significant coheir to her parents, which does not match
Wevia's family where two sons would be expected to acquire most of the family land.)
Hugh de Montgomery and Joscelina had a son Roger, but contrary to Torigny's
statements, he was not the Conquest baron of that name, but instead his father. By a
wife possibly named Emma, Roger had: Hugh; Roger (who married Mabel of Belleme
and played a significant role in pre-Conquest Normandy); William (who murdered
cousin Osbern); Robert, and Gilbert.
Duvelina, a second sister of Gunnor, married Turulf de Pont Audemer, son of a
Norman founder Torf, and uncle of the first of the Harcourts. They had at least one
son, Humphrey de Vielles, who in turn was father of Roger de Beaumont, another
Conquest-era baron.
Wevia, the only other sister of Gunnor named by Torigny, married Osbern de Bolbec
(who is otherwise unknown to history). They had at least two sons: Walter Giffard,
ancestor of the English Giffard/Gifford families, and also, through his daughter, of the
Clare family; and Godfrey, whose son William de Arques had two daughters and co-
heiresses.
Torigny indicates that Gunnor had numerous nieces, names the descendants of
several of them, but the accounts of these families are more difficult to harmonize with
other available sources, as has already been seen with niece Joscelina.
One niece is said to have married Nicholas de Bracqueville, and to have had William
Martel and Walter de St. Martin. As to Martel, there seems to have been a connection
to this family, since Hawise, daughter of Nicholas married Hugh de Wareham, son of a
Grippo. Hugh had a brother Geoffrey Martel, but beyond this no recent analysis
provides any insight as to the descent of the later Martels. Walter de St. Martin is
even more of a problem, since elsewhere Torigny incorrectly makes him brother of
William de Warenne, but the ancestry given there is clearly false. Thus it is not clear
that Torigny knew the exact connection of Walter, and no evindece to clarify his true
origins.
A second niece is said to have married Richard, vicomte of Rouen (who was son of
Tesselin). He had a son Lambert of St. Saens, whose son Helias married a bastard
daughter of Robert II of Normandy. (If the connection here given is correct, then
these two were withing the prohibited degree, which may throw doubt on the
relationship, or simply suggest that the relationship did not come to light at the time.)
Based on later interactions between Montgomery and Warenne (thought to be related
to this branch) it has been speculated that this niece was sister of Joscelina, which is
possible but unsupported.
It appears to be through this family that the relationship of two more Norman barons
come into play, but not exactly as Torigny presents it. He shows yet another niece
marrying Ranulph de Warenne, and by him having William de Warenne and Roger de
Mortimer. This is clearly untrue, because Roger appears to have been a generation
older than William. The solution appears to be that Torigny (as he had done with the
Montgomerys) compressed into one individual a father and son of the same name.
Ranulph de Warenne (I) appears to have married Beatrice, sister of Richard, vicomte
of Rouen, and thus sister-in-law of one of Gunnor's nieces (thus it would appear that
this family actually does not descend from a relative of Gunnor's, but is genealogically
linked to some of her descendants) and had sons: Roger (de Mortimer) and Ranulph
de Warenne (II), who in turn was father of another Ranulf (III) and of William de
Warenne.
Finally, Torigny states that a niece married Osmund de Centumvillis, vicomte of
Vernon, and had a son Fulk de Alnou, and a daughter whose son was Baldwin de
Reviers. Much debate has focussed on the attempt to identify these men, but in the
latter case, clearly a connection to the Reviers/Vernon Earls of Devon is intended.
The precise nature of the relationship is more difficult to pin down. It would seem that
the first Earl Richard de Reviers was son of a Baldwin, who had brothers Richard de
Vernon (app. d.s.p.) and William Fitz Hugh de Vernon (perhaps a half-brother, who by
wife Emma had a son Hugh, often confused with a Hugh, brother of Earl Richard. It is
this error that has led to the statement that Emma was the relative of Gunnor, which
derives from a set of relationships hypothesized in CP (under Devon) and predicated
on her being mother of Hugh, brother of Earl Richard, an untrue relationship.). If
Baldwin, father of Earl Richard, was the same as the grandson of Osmund de
Centumvillis this would complete the picture, but one more relationship invites
comment. Earl Richard is said by an early source, cited by CP, to be nephew of
William Fitz Osbern. This may enable us to place the unnamed wife of Osmund as
sister of William Fitz Osbern, and thus a great-niece rather than a niece of Gunnor,
although this solution strains chronology.
The work of Robert de Torigny thus provides a valuable source for the genealogical
origins of the immediate pre-Conquest Norman aristocracy. When it has been possible
to compare the information with other sources, some inconsistancies are found, but it
is unclear whether these represent errors of Robert, or inaccuracies in the
genealogical traditions he was recording. In most cases, an in-depth study of the
available material has enabled modern historians to satisfactorilly reconstruct the
descents from Gunnor's family and provide a representation of the true relationships
among these early Norman families.
taf
Parents
DE ARQUE Herfast (ABT 885 - )
----- ----- ()
Siblings
DE ARQUE Herbastus (ABT 911 - 979)
Marriage To OLAFSDOTTIR Gunild (ABT 920 - )
m.
Notes
Parents
BJORNSSON Olaf (ABT 900 - ABT 975)
THRANDSDOTTIR Ingeberg (ABT 886 - )
Children by OLAFSDOTTIR Gunild ABT 920 -
DE CREPON Gunnora (ABT 942 - 5 Jan 1031)
DE ARQUE ----- (ABT 944 - )
DE ARQUE Senfrie (Senfria) (Seinfreda) (ABT 950 - )
DE CREPON Herfast (ABT 950 - )
DE CREPON Duvelina (Eva) (Dulceline) (ABT 953 - )
DE CREPON Avelina (Wevia) (ABT 957 - )
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